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  #1   IP: 68.83.12.178
Old November 13th, 2002, 04:52 PM
imported_jdcableguy imported_jdcableguy is offline
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Default Code requirements for a kitchen island

The kitchen island that I am installing during the remolding willhave two duplex recpt. (one on each side) . Are these required to be GFIC or can they be standard. both are located above the counter top . There is no sink located in the island - just the range at the one end with a 6'' rise to the table top.
Thanks
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  #2   IP: 148.78.247.10
Old November 14th, 2002, 04:45 AM
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Wgoodrich Wgoodrich is offline
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Be aware that you are forbidden to install a receptacle in the face up position on a counter top. How are you mounting on an island above the counter top? Are you within 20" of that counter top surface as required? Are you aware that the NEC 2002 now states that an island that is flat counter with no means to mount a receptacle above the counter top and has no cabinet above that island counter top within 20" of that counter surface any receptacle may be omitted from being required to serve that island?

Remember that if you do install a receptacle to serve that counter it must be GFI protected.

Also no receptacle is required to serve a counter space on an island that is not at least 12" x 24" .

Hope this helps

Wg
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  #3   IP: 208.17.34.25
Old November 14th, 2002, 05:57 AM
imported_jdcableguy imported_jdcableguy is offline
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If you are standing facing the range. There is a 18'' base cabinet on the left and right of the range. I built a 2x6 partition behind the base cabinets to allow for a transition to the island . Since the top of the base cabinets and the eating area of the island are at different heights. I will be able to mount these on the verticle stud within the partition and be within the 20'' area.
One other question? There is quite a bit of countertop space- I have two 20 appliance curcuits w/GFIC breakers. I also have a microwave rated for 15a circuit , I ran a dedicated 20 a circuit for this . Could I feed the island recpt off this microwave circuit and used a GFIC recpt or would the microwave cause the GFIC to trip?
I can run a seperate circuit for the island also/
PS. You have a great site here . Even if I am not looking for answers it is educational just browsing .
Thanks
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  #4   IP: 148.78.247.10
Old November 14th, 2002, 01:32 PM
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Wgoodrich Wgoodrich is offline
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I understand now that you are mounting your receptacles below the island counter space yet above the eating bar. This island has an appliance separating this island counter by that appliance making two island counter areas. From your discription neither of the two island sections are 12" x 24" or larger therefor no receptacles are required at all by the NEC. If you wish to install the receptacles anyway then you have a rule that dictates any receptacle installed below the counter area designed to serve that counter area must be installed no more than 6" below the counter top.

YOu microwave is an IF. If this microwave is a table top microwave designed to sit on the counter top it can be plugged into any kitchen receptacle. However if this microwave is a combo exhaust fan microwave or is a microwave placed into a microwave cabinet then it is required to be served by a dedicated 20 amp branch circuit.

If you wish to install the receptacles to serve your island counter spaces then you may supply power to these island receptacles from one of the minimum of two small appliance branch receptacle circuits required to serve the other counter areas of your kitchen. These two required small appliance receptacle branch circuits serving the kitchen counter area not only is allowed to serve receptacles on islands and penninsular but also is allowed to serve receptacles in the dining, nook, and pantry rooms. Remember no lighting, fastened in place appliances [including microwaves inside microwave cabinets] or anything in any other room is allowed to be shared on these small appliance branch circuits. The island, penninsula and kitchen counter areas are required to be served by GFI protection. A counter top mirowave is expected to be GFI protected. A microwave in a microwave cabinet or microwave hood combo is not expected to be GFI protected.

Hope this helps

Wg
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  #5   IP: 129.138.88.154
Old April 3rd, 2003, 01:55 AM
rmilner rmilner is offline
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Default kitchen island receptacles

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wgoodrich
[...] Are you aware that the NEC 2002 now states that an island that is flat counter with no means to mount a receptacle above the counter top and has no cabinet above that island counter top within 20" of that counter surface any receptacle may be omitted from being required to serve that island?
We just finished remodeling our kitchen, including a new 3'x4' island. It has a flat stone countertop, and is built of 4 base cabinets fastened together and bolted to the floor (which is new sheet-vinyl on concrete slab) with panels covering the sections that don't have doors. There is nothing above the island but 8' ceiling, and no gaps between the 4 cabinets to run wire through. The electrician who did our new lighting and rewired appliance circuits did not inform us before construction was virtually complete that code required an outlet for the island; we found out during the final electrical inspection. The only way I'm aware of to get AC service to the island now is with a pendant outlet of some sort; but there is a new recessed light centered over it which would have to be removed to accommodate this, so it would be ugly, and I can't find anything about non-industrial options for such receptacles via the Web anyway.

Does your comment quoted above mean that in fact an outlet is no longer required by code for an island like this? I could not find any copies of the NEC 2002 online, only 1999.

Thanks!
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  #6   IP: 65.73.69.39
Old April 3rd, 2003, 06:01 AM
6pack 6pack is offline
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Your post sounds to myself, as if your local AHJ is requiring an outlet at that island? Correct. Your local jurisdiction (state) may require this( I dont know that) an overide of NEC. Thats just a possibility. You can check right here on sight! Go to home page, 2002 code, dwelling wiring, click (I think) on box installations and locations and it's spelled out in RED. Note all new 2002 code changes are in RED. This should answer what your asking, if your island meets those requirements. Sounds like it does to me, but then your local has the last word and Id think that would be your contractors problem. Hope that helps. Direct your thanks to WG and Don for this informative sight. GL2U
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  #7   IP: 65.73.69.39
Old April 3rd, 2003, 06:09 AM
6pack 6pack is offline
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rmilner, Sorry look at Box Setting!
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  #8   IP: 129.138.88.153
Old April 3rd, 2003, 11:01 AM
rmilner rmilner is offline
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Default Re: kitchen island codes

I checked the NM Electrical Code last night, and aside from a few amendments, they adopted the 2002 NEC "in its entirety" last summer. None of the amendments reference the relevant section
(210.52.C (2) ), so I don't understand the state inspector's insistence on it unless he simply hasn't checked that for changes in the last 9 months. Most of the sites posting articles that highlight NEC 2002 changes skip over that subsection.

I did eventually find WGoodrich's page about this, thank you. If someone could send me the exact wording of that exception (B) it would be very helpful so I can see if there's any room for ambiguous interpretation (didn't sound like it, though). I called my electrician this morning; he said he had checked it while writing a letter to the state TAC and not noticed this exception, but will check it again. Very odd.
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  #9   IP: 148.78.243.123
Old April 3rd, 2003, 05:38 PM
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Wgoodrich Wgoodrich is offline
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I have forgotten that I was corrected on this ruling at a convention. The NEC does not allow omittion of the requirement of receptacles on flat islands and penninsular.

If you read the exception the a and b that was read as to different exceptions are actually a sub part of the main exception.

The inspector is correct requiring you to install the receptacle. It is permitted but not required to be installed below the counter if nowhere above may be installed.

Check with your inspector to avoid the invite of hurting small children would he allow you to install a half moon raised floor receptacle facing horizontally on the counter top or a grommet like a desk has allowing the cords to fall through that closable grommet into the inside of the cabinet placing the receptacle inside the cabinet.

Sorry my mistake. Below is the copied section that I interpreted wanting to read what I interpreted but not truly what it says. I have a severe problem with that low receptacle for cords on the side of the cabinet right in front of a 2 year old with a fryer over their head. Maybe I read what I wanted and not what it truly said. This has been a fought over rule for the last 10 years.

COPIED SECTION OF 2002 NEC;
210.52
(5) Receptacle Outlet Location. Receptacle outlets shall be located above, but not more than 18 in. (458 mm) above the countertop. Receptacle outlets shall not be installed in a face-up position in the work surfaces or countertops. Receptacle outlets rendered not readily accessible by appliances fastened in place or appliances occupying dedicated space shall not be considered as these required outlets.
Exception: To comply with the conditions as specified in (a) or (b), receptacle outlets shall be permitted to be mounted not more than 12 in. (305 mm) below the countertop. Receptacles mounted below the countertop in accordance with this exception shall not be located where the countertop extends more than 6 in. (153 mm) beyond its support base.
a. Construction for the physically impaired
b. On island and peninsular countertops where the countertop is flat across its entire surface (no backsplashes, dividers, etc.) and there are no means to mount a receptacle within 18 in. (458 mm) above the countertop, such as an overhead cabinet

NOW I NEED TO GO CHANGE MY WORDS IN THAT ARTICLE.

Sorry

Wg
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  #10   IP: 65.73.69.111
Old April 3rd, 2003, 06:35 PM
6pack 6pack is offline
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Reread this 10 times still don't get it! Are we saying outlets are permitted below IS/PENIN counter top as mentioned if desired rather than a floor box outlet above on the counter top surface? Or this desk top style opening? Seems like a strange rule to me, I watched my kids grow up spilling there milk left to right directing that milk directly into the open floor box. Plus I'd think that box would even be a good spot for germs to form, not every woman would feel secure cleaning around that thing with a damp hot wash cloth. This one helps me to remember why I thought I was a bad reader or set the book down and went out and had a beer. Oh well thats just my feelings.
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