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Thread: Garage feeder question.

  1. #21

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    Okay, the whole house is either pvc or pex water pipes except at the high flow valve shower valve in one bathroom.
    Water comes in via pex into that shower valve and copper pipes go from the valve to the shower head and the spout.
    Do these copper pipes need to be bonded and if so what about the shower valve in the 2. bathroom since it is made out of metal too, pex in and out?


    The mechanical gaslines in the house are all cast iron pipes so I think they need to be bonded.

    Can the gaslines be bonded via a subpanel or does it have to be at the first disconnect,
    the meter panel in this case?

    If I have to bond them to the first disconnect I would bond it on the outside but the location raises a question.
    The grounding rods are between the panel and the gas pipe.
    Can I run a ground wire from the meter box to the ground rods and end at the gas line?

    Thank you

    *one more question, does a detached garage need an exterior receptacle(s) like a house?
    Last edited by acer66; April 30th, 2017 at 02:30 PM. Reason: One more question

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Kent, WA
    Posts
    8,533

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    Only "metallic water piping systems" need to be bonded. Lone segments of metal pipe do not. So I would say none of your water piping needs to be bonded.

    250.52(B)(1) specifically prohibits underground gas pipes from being an ground electrode. 250.104(B) covers bonding other metal piping, and they kind of conflict. It reads:
    250.104(B) Other Metal Piping. If installed in, or attached to, a building or structure, a metal piping system(s), including gas piping, that is likely to become energized shall be bonded to any of the following:
    (1) Equipment grounding conductor for the circuit that is likely to energize the piping system
    (2) Service equipment enclosure
    (3) Grounded conductor at the service
    (4) Grounding electrode conductor, if of sufficient size
    (5) One or more grounding electrodes used
    The bonding conductor(s) or jumper(s) shall be sized in accordance with 250.122, using the rating of the circuit that is likely to energize the piping system(s). The points of attachment of the bonding jumper(s) shall be accessible.

    Informational Note No. 1: Bonding all piping and metal air ducts within the premises will provide additional safety.
    Informational Note No. 2: Additional information for gas piping systems can be found in Section 7.13 of NFPA 54-2012, National Fuel Gas Code.

    My preference for bonding gas lines is to bond it to some gas appliance that also has electricity. The furnace is a good example, so run a ground wire from the equipment ground in the furnace circuit to a ground clamp on the gas pipe.

    A detached garage only requires the following receptacles:
    210.52(G)(1) Garages. In each attached garage and in each detached garage with electric power. The branch circuit supplying this receptacle(s) shall not supply outlets outside of the garage (meaning other building locations, not outside wall). At least one receptacle outlet shall be installed for each car space.

    I see no requirement for a detached garage to have any receptacles on the exterior. However, if you choose to install one, it can be on the garage circuit that is required for each car space.
    Mark
    Kent, WA

  3. #23

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    That sounds good, how much do I have to worry about the torque specs on the breakers etc.?

    Thank you

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Kent, WA
    Posts
    8,533

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    If you have any sense of torque with a screw driver, that is probably sufficient. Breaker torques are pretty tight though.

    The only time I used a torque wrench was on a 400A service. Was tighter than I thought.... I would consider using a torque wrench on larger breakers (100A or over) of if you really have no clue what X ft-lbs feels like.
    Mark
    Kent, WA

  5. #25

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    I passed my rough in with no problems today and the inspector even asked me if I am an electrician.


    Thank you very much for your help.

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