HOT TUB

[Anonymous]

CAN I USE UF CABLE , UNDERGROUND 18" DEEP, TO MY HOT TUB (240/60A), #6/4WIRE-BLK,RD,WHT,&BARE GRND? ALSO IS THE ON/ OFF SW THE DISCONNECT? AS I SEE NOTHING IN INST'S ABOUT THIS NOR DO I SEE A BREAKER OR SW WHERE WIRE'S TERMINATE TO HOT TUB. ALSO IN MY MAIN ELECTRIC PANEL,WHERE THE WHITE AND BARE GROUNDS CONNECT?THEY ARE NOT ? SEPERATED, THERE ARE 7ROMEX CABLES(KIT REMODEL)IN TOP OF BOX AND THOSE WHT&BARE GRND'S CONNECT TO THE SAME TERMINAL BAR AS OUTSIDE MAIN WHITE WIRE? IS THIS OK? OTHERWISE THERE ARE PIPES AND METAL CABLE IN MAIN BOX. IN REVIEWING I WILL USE DP/60A/GFI. THE 5' DISC SW OUTSIDE IS WHAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT AND IF I NEED TO HAVE CABLE(UF)IN PIPE, LOOKS LIKE IT WOULD BE HARD TO GET PIPE TO FIT CONN BOX IN TUB, THE WAY HOLES AND SPACING LOCATED? ALSO NO DECK INVOLVED FOR PLACEMENT OF (5') SW'? WHY SW? TY :?

[Wgoodrich]

YOU SAID;
CAN I USE UF CABLE , UNDERGROUND 18" DEEP, TO MY HOT TUB (240/60A), #6/4WIRE-BLK,RD,WHT,&BARE GRND?

REPLY;
If the wire is direct buried it must be at least 24" deep. If the wire is in a PVC rigid conduit it must at least 18" deep.

UF cable with a black, red, white and a bare equipment grounding conductor contained in that cable may be used only while that wire is within the house not outside the house. Romex may be installed in the same manner. Once your wiring exits the house then that wiring must be in conduit with a black,red,white and green insultated grounding conductor all contained in a conduit. Outside the home structure UF or Romex neither is allowed to be used because it is not in a conduit and without an insulated grounding conductor. The bare wire inside a UF or Romex cable is only covered not insulated. see 680.23.F.1 that would apply

Also if your hot tub has an underwater light then the branch circuit serving that hot tub containing an underwater light fixture must be a dedicated branch circuit with an insulated grounding conductor and the entire branch circuit must have a black,red,white, green insulated grounding conductor contained in a conduit the entire length of that branch circuit from the enclosure containing the overcurrent device serving that hot tub to the hot tub. This conduit requirement includes that part of that wire serving that hot tub with an underwater light in the hot tub that is installed even inside the structures.

YOU SAID;
ALSO IS THE ON/ OFF SW THE DISCONNECT? AS I SEE NOTHING IN INST'S ABOUT THIS NOR DO I SEE A BREAKER OR SW WHERE WIRE'S TERMINATE TO HOT TUB.

REPLY;
An emergency disconnect form is not required concerning a hot tub in a dwelling setting. However a disconnect form must be installed within sight of [can be seen from the hot tub and not more than 50' from the hot tub] of the hot tub. This may be a 240 volt weatherproof non fused disconnect mounted on the house if not over 50' from the hot tub and insight. If you have a breaker inside the hot tub that came with the hot tub then you may use that hot tub breaker supplied by the manufacturer as you form of disconnect. If you install that disconnect form as required because the hot tub did not come with a breaker in it hot tub unit supplied by the manufacturer then your required disconnect form must be installed a minimum of 5' from that hot tub but insight of that hot tub. I doubt that you will find a 50 amp rated snap switch on the market that will full fill this disconnect form requirment.

Most hot tubs are rated 240 volts if yours is a 240 volt rated hot tub then the following would apply;

Your overcurrent device must be a GFI breaker double pole 240 volt rated 50 or 60 amp rated installed either in the main panel at the beginnning of this hot tub branch circuit or in the required hot tub disconnect form mounted in sight of but beyond 5' from the hot tub using a normal double pole, or if the manufacturer supplied you with a double pole GFI breaker inside the hot tub this manufacture supplied double pole GFI breaker or built in 120 volt GFI protective device built into the hot tub and a normal 240 volt breaker again supplied by the manufacturer may serve as the required form of disconnect. see Article 680.44 and 430.102.B and 680.12

YOU SAID;
ALSO IN MY MAIN ELECTRIC PANEL,WHERE THE WHITE AND BARE GROUNDS CONNECT?THEY ARE NOT ? SEPERATED, THERE ARE 7ROMEX CABLES(KIT REMODEL)IN TOP OF BOX AND THOSE WHT&BARE GRND'S CONNECT TO THE SAME TERMINAL BAR AS OUTSIDE MAIN WHITE WIRE? IS THIS OK?

REPLY;
You said "main electrical panel" in main panels the neutrals and grounding conductors and bars are supposed to be married together and intermixed as one entity.

Any panel that is located as a slave of the main panel then the neutrals and grounding bars and conductors must be separated.

Nowhere in a structure located beyond the main service rated panel is the neutral supposed to ever touch a grounding bar, non current carrying metallic part or grounding conductor. Within the main service rated panel the neutrals and groundings are married as one. Beyond the main service rated panel never again should a neutral or grounding ever again touch.

YOU SAID;
OTHERWISE THERE ARE PIPES AND METAL CABLE IN MAIN BOX. IN REVIEWING I WILL USE DP/60A/GFI. THE 5' DISC SW OUTSIDE IS WHAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT AND IF I NEED TO HAVE CABLE(UF)IN PIPE, LOOKS LIKE IT WOULD BE HARD TO GET PIPE TO FIT CONN BOX IN TUB, THE WAY HOLES AND SPACING LOCATED? ALSO NO DECK INVOLVED FOR PLACEMENT OF (5') SW'?

REPLY;
The questions in this part of your post are repeatative and should have been answered prior in my replies. The last of this section you hit a new question.

In dwelling units the disconnect switch if not provide by the manufacturer must be beyond 5' from the hot tub but insight of the hot tub.

As for conduit connecting directly to the hot tub there is a rule in the NEC that allows sealtite to be used if not subject to physical damage. Sealtite is normally allowed to also be buried and you can convert from PVC conduit using a threaded terminal adapter and a rigid coupling then a sealtite connector to convert from PVC to sealtite. Sealtite is allowed to be used in a length not exceeding 6' concerning a hot tub to allow for flexibility.

YOU SAID;
WHY SW?

REPLY;
The form of disconnect is required for safety to allow the hot tub to be worked on with the disconnect form in sight ensuring that power remains off while the hot tub is being worked on.

Hope this helps

Wg

[Anonymous]

Ty for your time! If I understand right I need to run (uf which I already purchased #6/3/wGRND) according to code to disc,mounted on house,from disc I run (18"deep) 1" pvc to the hot tub with 3/#6(blk,rd,wht) and 1#10grn. If unable to get pipe into the manfc's box with pvc, I can convert to Sealtight within 6' of hot tub.?there is two types of Sealtight?one has metal inside liner and one doesn't will assume I can use one without metal liner since installing the green wire?Then install 60Amp GFI breaker! Sound right Forgot to mention ther is swing set(metal) within reach of tub if you streach, is this a problem,can't move any farther must I do something with this? I was told to run a wire (bare)from it to my main box and ground? what if right size wire would I use? Ty again

[Wgoodrich]

If you have a light in that hot tub then it must be conduit all the way from the panel.

That part that is outside the house must not only be in conduit but must be with individual single conductors including a green insulated grounding conductor in this case being a 10 awg copper green insulated equipment grounidng conductor in that conduit with a single black and a single white and a single red conductor in that conduit. Do not use any type of nonmetallic sheathed cable in the conduit while outside the dwelling structure.

UF cable does not have an insulated grounding conductor but only a covered grounding conductor. While outside the wiring is required to be in a conduit but also must have a green insulated grounding conductor that the UF cable does not have [covered only in UF cable].

The swing set if within 5' of the hot tub must have an 8 awg copper conductor connecting that noncurrent carrying metallic swing set to the metal casing of the noncurrent carrying metallic parts of hte hot tub. [normally you will find a lug on the metal casing of your hot tub motor. Connect a 8 awg copper conductor to the motor casing lug of the hot tub and run that 8 awg copper conductor to the swing set and connect that 8 awg copper BONDING GRID wire to the swing set by a two piece grounding connector.

It is not the intention of the NEC to have you connect the bonding grid to any equipment grounding system of the structural electrical wiring system other than by incidental connections within the motor.

[associrated to the hot tub, all noncurrent carrying metallic parts 4" square or larger located within 5' of that hot tub must be bonded together to make up the BONDING GRID SYSTEM].

Hope this helps

Wg

[Anonymous]

:thanks for the follow up and your time. EXplation was complete while understantable and to the point! ty again will put the word out on your web!

[Wgoodrich]

Good Luck and safe progress to you and yours

Wg