Wiring Baseboard Heaters

[Anonymous]

Posted by: OneBetter (old forum transfer)
Posted - 06/14/2002 : 14:08:16

Ok I need to install 8 Baseboard Heaters but the house is already drywalled so what I am wondering here is how can I run the wire from the baseboards in all the different rooms to the panel without just running the wire along the drywall showing. this is a 2 floor house, the main floor which there is no basement just rock underneath! (its an old house) and the upstairs but the whole house is drywalled, so say to install a baseboard upstairs how can i get the wire to the panel which is downstairs on the main floor? I have to do all 8 of them but some of them i am going to run 2 to one 20amp breaker because they dont total more than 2800 watts but i really need to know how I can hide this wire in drywall without it showing and get it to the panel! thank you very much if you can reply to this and help!! THANKS!!!

[Anonymous]

Posted by: Wgoodrich
Posted - 06/15/2002 : 12:21:51

My first concern is your statement the you plan to connect 2 - 8 foot baseboard heaters on the same circuit because they only pull 2800 watts. A 20 amp circuit has a maximum pull of 4800 watts. Baseboard heaters are normally rated at 250 watts per foot. You could install around 18 feet of heat on any 20 amp 240 volt circuit. YOu also can run a 20 amp 240 volt branch circuit from the panel to the first thermstat in one room then run a power out of that thermostat to a second room feeding that thermostat thus adding more load to utilize around 80% of that 20 amp circuit. You could run each heater on a single circuit but you will increase your cost factor with little benifit.

When you place baseboard heaters in a room for a zone type heat you should place the baseboard heaters in smaller footage making say two four foot heaters in a room making your 8 foot heater. This way you can place your two heaters instead of one heater in locations that will block convection or conventional heat loss such as drafts. Baseboard heaters should be so placed to be along the outside walls nearest outside doors and window. Most often under windows where furniture is less likely to block the heaters and also effectively block cold drafts from those heat loss areas to the outside for better heating comfort.

Remember to keep your curtains and furniture away from the front of thase baseboard heaters to avoid risk of fire.

Normally when you have a finished basement you locate an existing or create a new chase along the point where the ceiling and walls meet. To build a wiring or heating duct chase you can nail to 2 x 2 boards one on the ceiling and one on the wall. Then use drywall or plywood nailed to a third 2 x 2 joining the wallboard on one long side. Then nail the box you made to the two 2 x 2 boards mounted to the wall surrounding your wires inside that chase style boxed in area. You can later cut holes in that duct for future installation where needed to install future equipment in that chase then screw square blocks or hinged doors covering those holes you made for future installations. If you install this chase mounted to the ceiling and wall where they meet all the way around your basement area you are creating a method of running wires horizontally to both the basement and the main floor area by going up or down into the walls of that basement of main floor to equipment you need to get to.

Then to move from the basement to the second floor you can find two clothes closets stacked on top of each other on each floor using the back corner of those clothes closets to again create a chase most commonly a finishe 1 x 6 or 1 x 8 making an angled corner in each closet allowing you to install wires from the panel down into the chase you made in the basement to the clothes closets stacked above each other then up those chases in the clothes closet to the attic above the second floor. If you need to run horizontally between the basement ceiling and hte first floor or between the first floor ceiling to the second floor then you may use those spanning floor joist spaces whenever available to use.
YOu may then fish from the attic of the second floor or the new chase in the basement down the walls to your baseboard heaters.

HOpe this gives you some ideas.

Wg

[Anonymous]

Posted by: OneBetter
Posted - 06/16/2002 : 17:19:23

Ok thank you very much for the help, I am still a little confused though, what do you mean by make a chase etc. I understand by what you mean about pulling 4800 but from what I read in the code book, (I also live in Ontario, Canada) So if you are in the states the codes may be different, but what do you mean by making a chase etc. sorry I am not to sure of that meaning. Anymore help on that would be appreciated! Thanx

Doug

[Anonymous]

Posted by: Wgoodrich
Posted - 06/16/2002 : 17:42:51

Nail a 2 x 2 to the wall about 8 to 12" down the wall from the sealing. Then Nail a 2 x 2 to the ceiling out on the ceiling away from the wall about 8 to 12" matching the distance you went down the wall only place it on the ceiling away from the corner where the wall and ceiling meet. Then use drywall and a third 2 x 2 to make a box where the wall and ceiling meet. What you are doing is making a duct along the wall opposite of the direction your ceiling joists are running to run wires horizontal within that box you made creating a wiring chase or boxed in area. This box in area can be a small or large as you like to fit your needs.

Good Luck

Wg

[Anonymous]

Posted by: OneBetter
Posted - 06/17/2002 : 18:11:20

Ok, I get what your saying now, that will creat a box in the corner of the wall for the wires to go into, but that will still require to run wires along the drywall to go into the box. Is there any other way as well to do this without creating this chase etc.?

[Anonymous]

Posted by: Wgoodrich
Posted - 06/17/2002 : 22:38:41

YOu could install a conduit exactly in the corner where the ceiling and wall meets then plaster over that conduit making an beveled corner.

YOu could cut about 8" of drywall out and remove it drilling the joists to get the wires across the house then patch the drywall then tape and bed that patch to a finished wall again.

Good Luck

Wg

[Anonymous]

Posted by: OneBetter
Posted - 06/20/2002 : 22:32:18

Ok sounds good, but the problem I forgot to mention is this isnt for my own house, this is for another persons house and I am doing the work for them, so that kinda leaves that stuff outta it, cuz it requires to much time and to much money etc. any other ideas? sorry for being such a pain!!

[Anonymous]

Posted by: Wgoodrich
Posted - 06/21/2002 : 08:09:53

The options I discribed in my previous replies are the only methods other than installing a suspended ceiling in the basement which would make a big chase to run your wires. I have no other ideas in mind.

Hope this helps

Wg

[Anonymous]

Posted by: OneBetter
Posted - 06/21/2002 : 14:13:08

ok no prob! thanx for all your help, what about just running the wires from the baseboards to the panel along the floor and bottom of the wall? they would be showing, but hydro would never be out there so the only ppl that would know are the ppl that are living there, would that be ok?

[Anonymous]

Posted by: Wgodorich
Posted - 06/21/2002 : 16:27:20

Sorry just because people won't know does not make it safe. The people that won't know are normally the people that would have told you to run Romex exposed along the floor on the baseboard is normally considered exposed to physical damage by furniture or kids toys etc. hitting that cable often causing a short circuit that commonly burns down houses and or hurts people. Then firemen and ambulance drivers may know.

Normally exposed Romex low on the wall is considered not meeting the NEC due to exposure to physical damage. Probably wouldn't be a good idea to take that short cut.

If you do and damage does occur causing property damange or personal injury, insurance companies won't be liable but the person who installed that wiring not meeting the minimum safety standards would be liable. Suspect that would be you. I would say to take the easy route in installing those cables are up to you and if you want to gamble everything you own on the fact nothing will happen.

Choice is yours, hope you make the safe choice, often times saving a little money may take all your money if a disaster happens. Wiring has a tendency to create those disasters. Be safe, not sorry.The easy way is most often not the safe way.

Wg

[Anonymous]

Posted by: OneBetter
Posted - 06/27/2002 : 01:23:38

ok sounds good, so running BX Cable low on the wall isnt good, what about running it high on the wall at the ceiling?

[Anonymous]

Posted by: Wgoodrich
Posted - 06/27/2002 : 18:20:12

I want to clarify a word you used before I issue a reply to your quest in your last post.

You used a very old term that of BX cable that no longer exists. Replacement of BX cable is MC cable or type AC cable. Both MC and AC looks a lot like BX cable but these two cables that replaced BX cable contains a method of an equipment grounding that the BX cable did not have.

If you install either metal clad, aluminum clad or Romex high on the wall and not exposed to physical damage you may install those cables on the surface of the wall.

You need to confirm with your local electrical inspector to make a ruling to make sure you are not in violation of a local ordinance forbidding that type wiring but the NEC says you can install Romex, metal clad, and aluminum clad cable on the surface of a wall that is not subject to physical damage. In my opinion installing cables along the ceiling then properly sleeving that cable when it comes down the wall into an area that can be considered exposed to physical damage would be a proper installation.

Hope this helps

Wg

[Anonymous]

Posted by: OneBetter
Posted - 06/30/2002 : 21:18:57

ok thanx, I did mean AC-90 not bx, just i call it bx meaning the same but yes i did check and it is ok to install in high or low here, because it it shieled
thank you for all your help, i am going to go ahead and install it that way

[Anonymous]

Posted by: Wgoodrich
Posted - 06/30/2002 : 22:49:57

Good luck with your project.

Wg